What If Sustainable Success Never Requires Self Sacrifice And Stress

Welcome And The Core Question

0:20 SPEAKER_01: Hello and welcome to Work Stress Anxiety. I'm Cheryl Paris. You know, what if the useful question in a stressful moment isn't what do I want? But what am I wanting? You know, that tiny difference I think matters because one of my favourite moments in this conversation with Paula is around that. Today we explore how coming back to the presentation can help us notice what's driving the decision. Distinguishing urgency from expressing urgency. And choosing a steady next moment that expected ourselves to suddenly become expected stress.

1:19 SPEAKER_01: Let's get started. Hi and welcome to work stress anxiety. I'm Cheryl Paris. If you are new here, welcome. If you've been before, even better. Because you're gonna be so surprised by the insights you're going to learn about work stress and anxiety with our wonderful guest, Paula. Welcome, Paula.

1:43 SPEAKER_00: Thank you, Cheryl. I'm excited to be here.

1:46 SPEAKER_01: You know, one of the things I find really interesting about the work that we do around stress is that most of the people that I work with, and I'm laughing. The reason why I'm laughing is because um I remember this was uh one of my first clients, and she left me a testimonial and she said, Oh my life, or words to this effect, it is so difficult working with Cheryl. And uh and I thought, I don't know whether that's a good testimonial or not, but luckily she put it in in context in in that she said that I am one of these people, I try to, and I put I suppose it's part of what um my own method, I try to get people back into reality, whatever reality is.

Why Reality And Awareness Matter

2:38 SPEAKER_01: So it's not to me, and I'm sure you probably agree, it's not about judging things, it's just about this is where we are, and as uncomfortable as it is, this is the best place, the most exciting place to start change from. And I think for her that we we because we'd spent such a long time in I call that f that awareness phase, that's what she found the most difficult because she is a highly motivated person. She um was doing a very stressful job, but she thought she was doing it fine until and even when she experienced burnout, um, she kind of went back to the same kind of habits that she was doing before.

3:30 SPEAKER_01: And I think that's when she realized, and that's when you know we started working together. But I know that lots of people probably in the back of their minds think, oh yeah, stress is making decisions for me. Paula, I'm curious to know what do you think is one of the first small pauses that they can take that's not too dramatic? Yeah, we're not asking people to, you know, pack up their, you know, them their lives and move somewhere else. What what is one of the small things they can do to help um move them in the right direct direction?

4:08 SPEAKER_00: I love this. Such a good question because we don't talk about this enough. Um, and even if we did pack up and move our lives, guess who's coming with us? Us. So that doesn't really work. Um what's one simple thing you can do?

The Micro Pause What Am I Wanting

4:26 SPEAKER_00: Oh, I love this. It's a simple question. Ask yourself, what am I wanting? Just right here in this moment. What am I wanting? It's a simple question. Not what do I want? Don't ask that because your brain already has lots of answers to that question, and it's what got you here in the first place. So, what am I wanting? It's a question in the present moment, and it's not something you've asked yourself before, I'm pretty sure. Uh, when we ask ourselves that question, suddenly we can see things from a different perspective.

5:06 SPEAKER_00: Our priorities shift because we recognize what's truly important to us in that question, and we can make a different decision.

5:16 SPEAKER_01: And it's really interesting, you know, it's that simple thing of adding ing on the end that completely changed the context of that question. Because I know, and I'm sure you know you uh have experience of that, that's often the question a lot of coaches ask people, what do you want? And I'm like you, it's it's not about the noun want, it's about the verb wanting that makes all the difference to how people um not only start on their journey of um change, and when I mean change, I mean moving towards the things that they they want, but also helps them along the way.

True Urgency Versus Panic Urgency

5:59 SPEAKER_01: Um now Paula, what other other things can people do that can make a real difference between a decision made in genuine urgency and a decision that's made from panic dressed up as urgency. And I'm I mean i in particular in the context of the workplace, because I know that so many people, especially us high, high achieving women, we want to do well. In fact, some of the some of the times it's almost um in fairness, I think for a lot of people, even because they haven't and I'm I am making a judgment here, so excuse me, listeners, sometimes we forget to define what our values are, what motivate us, the reasons why we're doing all these things.

6:56 SPEAKER_01: So in light of that, uh what do you think, Paula?

7:00 SPEAKER_00: So you make a really good point of clarifying the difference between true, genuine urgency and panic disguising itself as urgency. That's like there's a difference between being busy and being productive, right? There's a difference between being successful and having sustainable success. And they're all related. Um, when something is truly urgent, there's a different energy around it than when something is panic driven presenting itself as urgent. So give you an example. Uh you have a truly urgent deadline.

7:43 SPEAKER_00: Let's say you're handling I I'll use myself for example. In my previous life, I was a corporate senior claims specialist in the insurance industry. So there were definitely specifically true urgent deadlines in the court system. There's certain deadlines to get your your filings done, there's certain deadlines to get your evidence in, there's certain deadlines for the process, right? So that's a true urgency. It's not panic-driven, it's it's just this is what's going on right now. So true urgency is this is just what's going on right now.

8:18 SPEAKER_00: My basement is flooding. That's what's going on right now. My car won't start. I have to be at work. That's that's urgency, right? Panic disguising itself as urgency is oh my gosh, what are they gonna think because I'm not X, Y, or Z? I can't say no to this because they're gonna think I can't take it on. Or I can't I can't sleep at night the nine hours I'd like to sleep because I have this workload that has decided for me that sleep is not important. So I need to sleep four to five hours a night, so I have more time to do the work, right?

9:04 SPEAKER_00: These are these are reactive panic-driven things that can feel very urgent in the moment, but they're not really urgent. They're assumptions that we're making that trigger stress, compound stress, and are not sustainable. So how do we know the difference between the two? Ask yourself, is this what's truly just going on right now? Or am I making this a bigger deal than it really is? And that's not always easy to do in the moment. But the more we practice that, the easier it becomes to recognize. And I think awareness is the biggest key.

Overcommitting And Choice Mastery

9:43 SPEAKER_01: Cool. Now, um, it's interesting because I call that type of panic urgency addiction. And I I think it's very um it's very common in a lot of workplaces where people are trying, especially um you want to impress your boss, you want to show that you're you know you're a team player, maybe you're interested in promotion and you want everyone to to see how well you're doing. But I also know several people, you know who you are, you're listening right now, and you have spent years overcommitting, overriding, you know, almost leaving behind your friends, your family in this pursuit of something.

10:30 SPEAKER_01: And what's the first act, Paula, of choice mastery that you think makes one of the biggest difference for someone who's been like that, who's literally spent years and years overriding that basal instinct that I need to stop doing this.

10:55 SPEAKER_00: So it's gonna be different for everybody, and yet it's going to be the same. So, how it's the same is that awareness piece. Understanding what's driving that decision in the first place, what's driving you to override, what's driving you to do the extra thing or to say yes when you really want to say no. It's going to be different for different people, and it's also going to be different for you in each and every situation. Um, you mentioned wanting to impress your boss, right? So many times, especially in the workplace, those decisions are being driven by this desire to prove our value.

11:30 SPEAKER_00: We have a little imposter syndrome going on, right? Sometimes it's a lot of imposter syndrome. Um, sometimes it's our strengths. It comes so easy for us that we like to do it, but then we forget that we're not using it for ourselves. Sometimes it's just this is how I've always done it. This is my pattern, this is my habit, this is my default, this is just how I go about my day. And so understanding in the moment what's driving that decision is the answer to how to choose differently. And it's it's a practice.

12:05 SPEAKER_00: Um, Cheryl, this is I even share in my book, like it took me three years to write this book. And two and a half years into it, when we're getting ready to like send it to the the formatter to do the, you know, the make sure it lays out right and all of those things. I found myself in the hospital having a panic attack. And I'm writing a book about choice mastery and how to avoid stress and how to reduce stress. Um, so even I, who is writing the book about how to do it, I still have my default habits and patterns of behavior that when I'm under stress can easily be triggered.

12:43 SPEAKER_00: So it's not that you'll never face stress and it's not that you'll always make the right choice for what you're wanting. But I will tell you, I share that in my book because I know that it's because of the work that I've done over the last decade plus that I was able to turn that around very quickly. What would have taken me months to maybe years to recover from, I turned it around within weeks because I knew how I knew what was happening. I was able to interrupt the stress cycle and I was able to make a different choice.

13:16 SPEAKER_00: So the awareness is is the biggest key and understand what's driving your decisions is the key to interrupting the stress cycle and then reprogramming that default behavior to be differently.

Burnout Beliefs And Facing What Is True

13:30 SPEAKER_01: Okay. Now, before I go, I'd really love to ask you this question. Now um I think it's fair to say that we've both experienced uh what a lot of people would call burnout, and we've um we've been w working and coaching people for years and we've learned a lot. Um my first question in light of that is there something that you used to believe that you don't believe anymore?

14:05 SPEAKER_00: Excellent question, and yes. I used to believe that I were if I worked really hard and sacrificed myself in what I thought was the short term, that I would get a benefit and success and pay out in the long term. I do not believe that anymore.

14:22 SPEAKER_01: Okay. Okay, really good. And the second question is we've worked with many different people. Okay. What is something that you have learned from your clients that you think, wow, that is so cool. I'm gonna be using that from now on.

14:44 SPEAKER_00: Oh, there's so many different moments where it's just, oh my gosh, what a unique perspective, or wow, that that drive or that that choice is so empowering. Um it's hard to think of one. I would say overall, the willingness to really look at what is true. You talked about the reality, what's what's really your reality, the willingness to face that uh really reinforces what what I do as well. Like watching someone who's struggling and willing to face the thing that they're struggling with is so empowering to witness, but also to apply by example.

15:31 SPEAKER_00: Like that, yes, always being open to facing what we don't see and what we might not be willing to look at, but know we need to.

15:40 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I would follow up by saying that's one of the things that I've learned um from my work um around coaching and hypnotherapy is that people are truly amazing. And, you know, um when I first started the c the podcast, it was actually called uh Amazing, Brilliant, Gorgeous, Wonderful.

16:03 SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I love it.

16:04 SPEAKER_01: And the reason for that was that I realized that I, you know, society puts let these labels on all of us so that we fit into nice little boxes so that um, dare I say it, people can control us in inverted commas. And I know in myself that that's what I wanted for myself. I want that's what I wanted to look in the mirror and see. And that's one of the reasons why I do the work that I do because I know that sometimes we lose sight of how amazing we are, how beautiful we are, you know, and how when I mean gorgeous, I mean that radiance that we all have to do our best.

Playlist Request And Closing Takeaway

16:51 SPEAKER_01: So, Paula, I want to thank you so much for all your insights today. It's been a real pleasure talking to you. But before you go, I'm gonna ask a favor of you if you don't mind. One of the things I'm looking to do is create a um, I told you that I love dancing and I love music. So if you don't know that about me, guys, and you've been listening to the podcast for a while, where have you been? But anyway, um, I'm trying to put together a Spotify playlist. Um, you know, I've got some songs that I want to include, but I've been asking all my guests for two songs.

17:29 SPEAKER_01: Okay. Now, these songs, it doesn't matter what genre they're in, or you know, what decade they were well, or who the artist is, but when you hear these two songs, Paula, you have to move. You just have to. It doesn't matter where you are, whether you're in the supermarket, you're in the library, you know, wherever you are, you just feel yourself wanting to move. You don't have to tell me what they are now, okay? Um, but would you would you be willing to share those two songs with me so I can put them on the on the playlist?

18:05 SPEAKER_01: Absolutely. Please. Excellent. Thank you, Paula. Thank you for your insights. Um, it's been a real pleasure talking to you. I've been looking forward to this so much. I can't honestly, I'm happy to admit it that you know I've been waiting so long to speak to you because I knew this would be so good, not only for me, but for people out there, us high flyers, us high-functioning women, especially, um, so that we can take that one more step towards the life that we want and away from burnout. So thank you, Paula.

18:42 SPEAKER_00: Cheryl, thank you so much. Um, and thank you for the work that you are doing. This is such an important conversation. And the the love and the light that you're putting out doing these podcasts and these interviews is just, and and the work that you do with your clients is, especially now, so much needed in the world. And it's just been a delight to have this conversation with you today. And I too have been really excited and looking forward to our connections. So thank you again so much for everything that you do and for having me on your podcast.

19:15 SPEAKER_01: Thank you. You know, Paula said something towards the end of our conversation that I think brings this whole thing that we and Paula have done together. She used to believe that if she worked hard enough and sacrificed herself in the short term, success would eventually make that sacrifice worthwhile. She told me she no longer believes that. And that matters because sustainable success should not required to disappear from your website. So I want to say thank you all for sharing and being so open across these conversations.

20:01 SPEAKER_01: And if this episode helps you, it's a good one.